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These files are maintained strictly for historical reference, research, and recordkeeping purposes,
and the content has not been altered or updated since archiving.
Content on this site may not meet current digital accessibility standards.
If you require an alternative, accessible format of any information found on this site,
please contact Bruce Jones, bjones@ucsd.edu to request an accommodation.

[xmca] critical perspectives

From: Andy Blunden <ablunden who-is-at mira.net>
Date: Thu Jan 03 2008 - 15:25:36 PST

>From: "Peter Sawchuk" <psawchuk@oise.utoronto.ca>
>
>Hi Andy,
>
>I just got a chance to leaf through xmca and, I think I can see why you
>would say that people may be misunderstanding your article somewhat (in
>part because there really isn't much of a focused discussion). The fact is
>I couldnt find a reasonable place to inter-act with the dialogue and the
>issues that I understand to be at hand in your piece [and, of course I
>found in general theres just so many silly off-shoots (about how to
>address people and terms of endearment; but maybe I dont know how to
>search the list properly)].
>
>In any case, I thought I would send you my own reading of it, and why I
>think it will be of value for my students for what it's worth...
>
>By way of background, I dont remember if I mentioned that the course I
>plan to use your article in is entitled Sociology of Learning and Social
>Movementsand I intend it to be a genuine dialogue across social movement
>theoryin sociology (and political science) and CHAT; CHAT being the most
>viable means of thinking about social movements in terms of a human
>developmental process. Your article appears in the latter half of the
>course. By the end students will be asked to apply CHAT to social movement
>research both empirically and conceptually.
>
>Ive planned to have your paper to arrivein our discussions at the point
>when I predict some important discussions will emerge about the nature of
>the subject. I intended to use the paper to give some meat to discussions
>of dialectical approaches to the subject, and this is where I see the core
>value for course discussion.
>
>I feel, as I think somebody else on the xmca remarked, that I may have to
>address the distinction you have between socialand the culturalin class
>discussion. I have to think a bit more about what Ill say on that between
>now and March, but any further, brief comments from you might be helpful
>but dont worry about it if you dont have the time. Also, the statement
>regarding the distinction between material production and inter-subjective
>exchange in Anna's work remains a bit opaque to me.
>
>In any case, I particularly like the posing of the challenge that CHAT
>appropriate social theory critically (including as you say intermediate
>conceptsId say this is a good starting point). This task is monumental,
>and is in fact the subject of a forthcoming paper in MCA by Anna Stetsenko
>and I where we focus on theories of conduct(social action and enactment)
>in the sociological tradition.
>
>I also particularly liked the way you situated CHAT and the ethos of
>progressive communitarianismas not being outmodedin a way that is not
>romanticized; somewhat connected here is the offhand linkage to Regulation
>Theory although I doubt it will emerge in our course discussions which
>reflects my feelings about sociology of work, economy, labour process
>theory, etc. as Ive written them in the past. (I teach courses on
>sociology of work)
>
>A point that is made about the dichotomy between thickand thinethos is an
>extremely interesting one for me as well. Mostly implicitly Ive worked
>with the idea that to understand subordinate social standpoints, in
>addition to lots of other matters, requires special attention to social
>life beginning from what I usually refer to as the cracks and crevicesof
>institutional life; I argue that this is where we are most likely to find
>positive expressions of these standpoints and, something akin to what
>Engestrom called expansive learning. I see that my thinking doesnt match
>with this thick and thin distinction all that well, as I see more intimate
>and developmental relations amongst subordinate social groups in the
>cracks and crevices while the thin ethosas youve defined it seems to be a
>place of anonymity and as you say on p.255 interaction between strangers.
>Perhaps Ill follow up the source documents on this; I have Agnes Heller's
>book on Everyday life and perhaps it's worth revisting.
>
>As I said, however, my main point of interest and congratulations is on
>the matter of dialectics. Dialectics are a fundamental component across
>several of our courses in the stream where I teach. The quick, concise
>review of Hegel is a nice little introduction. Dialectical analysis is
>obviously the key to unraveling the dichotomies you mention in social
>theory as well as CHAT, and the suggestive tracing this similar element
>(e.g. p.258 and then later on) in Vygotsky/Leontiev is highly useful. Im
>not quite convinced that Hegel is the first cultural-historical activity
>theoristsince there are a variety of matters to be debated regarding the
>meaning of the state in Hegel and of course his attention to materiality,
>etc. just harkening back to Marxist critique of which youre well aware Im
>sure; but its worth arguing, and of course I havent dug into Hegel for
>almost ten years now so this is refreshing. I actually remember Seth
>Chaiklin arguing something similar to me in some emails that eventually
>led to him writing the foreword for a book I did with Newton Duarte and
>Mohamed Elhammoumi. What is clear to me is that the dialectic remains an
>under-appreciated and certainly under-utilized method for understanding
>the complex dynamics that constitute activity and it is at the core of
>what I hope students will take from the article& Its application brings
>the boundaries between individual bodies and, for example, an institution,
>under the yoke of a method of analysis; a method that allows, among other
>things, for social scientists to put flesh on the bone of the oft-cited
>notion of "historicity" which to my mind is echoed in your comments on
>p.260-263.
>
>Anyways, that's my two cents worth.
>
>Best wishes - Peter
>
>
>Peter Sawchuk writes:
>Okay. I'll see if I can't find some time between xmas and new year to go
>into xmca - p
>
>Andy Blunden <ablunden@mira.net> writes:
>Wow! Spooky.
>If you're including it in your graduate course, that's a nice positive mark
>for the article. I fear it is going to die on xmca. It is not being
>understood. If you have a chance to drop in a message to xmca that would be
>nice.
>Anyway, thanks for your work, and some time later I may have something more
>to say. Digestion takes time.
>
>Andy
>At 02:00 PM 20/12/2007 -0500, you wrote:
> >Well this is pretty spooky. I literally just one minute ago finished
> >taking notes on your recent MCA article which I shall be including in a
> >new graduate course I'm pulling together for January entitled 'Sociology
> >of learning and social movements'.
> >
> >In any case, glad you liked that chapter (haven't heard much from anybody
> >about it). I do go onto xmca now and again, but I usually don't feel I
> >have the energy to do the discussion justice. I saw they're discussing
> >this paper of yours now; hope that goes well.Thanks for the comment.
> >Cheers - Peter
> >
> >Andy Blunden <ablunden@mira.net> writes:
> >Just read your article in "Critical Perspectives on Activity." Very nice
> work.
> >You don't participate in the xmca listserv?
> >
> >Andy Blunden
> >
> >
> > Andy Blunden :
> <<http://home.mira.net/~andy/>http://home.mira.net/~andy/>http://home.mira.net/~andy/
>
> > tel (H) +61 3 9380 9435,
> >mobile 0409 358 651
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >_______________________
> >Peter H. Sawchuk, PhD
> >Associate Professor
> >Sociology and Equity Studies in Education
> >Ontario Institute for Studies in Education
> >University of Toronto
> >252 Bloor Street West
> >Toronto, Ontario, Canada
> >M5S 1V6
> >(t) 416-978-0570
> >(e) psawchuk@oise.utoronto.ca
> >(f) 416-926-4751
> >
> >To find out about the Learning & Work Graduate Studies Program at OISE/UT:
> ><<http://www.learningwork.ca/courses>http://www.learningwork.ca/courses>h
> ttp://www.learningwork.ca/courses
>
> Andy Blunden : <http://home.mira.net/~andy/>http://home.mira.net/~andy/
> tel (H) +61 3 9380 9435,
>mobile 0409 358 651
>
>
>
>
>_______________________
>Peter H. Sawchuk, PhD
>Associate Professor
>Sociology and Equity Studies in Education
>Ontario Institute for Studies in Education
>University of Toronto
>252 Bloor Street West
>Toronto, Ontario, Canada
>M5S 1V6
>(t) 416-978-0570
>(e) psawchuk@oise.utoronto.ca
>(f) 416-926-4751
>
>To find out about the Learning & Work Graduate Studies Program at OISE/UT:
><http://www.learningwork.ca/courses>http://www.learningwork.ca/courses
>
>
>
>
>_______________________
>Peter H. Sawchuk, PhD
>Associate Professor
>Sociology and Equity Studies in Education
>Ontario Institute for Studies in Education
>University of Toronto
>252 Bloor Street West
>Toronto, Ontario, Canada
>M5S 1V6
>(t) 416-978-0570
>(e) psawchuk@oise.utoronto.ca
>(f) 416-926-4751
>
>To find out about the Learning & Work Graduate Studies Program at OISE/UT:
><http://www.learningwork.ca/courses>http://www.learningwork.ca/courses

  Andy Blunden : http://home.mira.net/~andy/ tel (H) +61 3 9380 9435,
mobile 0409 358 651

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Received on Thu Jan 3 15:26 PST 2008

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