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"Vraschivanie v kulturu" would indeed be well translated as "growing into
culture" or "Enculturation"
On Wed, September 29, 2010 16:50, Bella Kotik-Friedgut wrote:
> INTERIORIZATION!!!
>
> On Wed, Sep 29, 2010 at 9:11 AM, Rod Parker-Rees <
> R.Parker-Rees@plymouth.ac.uk> wrote:
>
>> How about 'intravolution'?
>>
>> Rod
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: xmca-bounces@weber.ucsd.edu [mailto:xmca-bounces@weber.ucsd.edu]
>> On
>> Behalf Of David Kellogg
>> Sent: 29 September 2010 00:53
>> To: xmca
>> Subject: [xmca] ??????????, or, Vygotsky's Jabberwocky
>>
>> We are wondering a little bit about how to translate made-up words, like
>> Vygotsky's "??????????" (in section 3 of Chapter 4 of Thinking and
>> Speech.
>>
>> ?? ???? ??????? ????????? ????????? ??????, ??????? ?? ??????? ????????
>> ??????? ????????????, ?????? ??? ??? ??????????????? ?????? ????? ???,
>> ???
>> ??????? ???????? ?????? ??????, ?????????? ?????????? ????????? ? ?
>> ????? ?
>> ???? ???????????? ???????? ?????????. ??? - ???? ? ??? ??? ?????
>> ??????????
>> ? ???????? ???????, ??? - ??? ?????????? ??????????? ???????
>> ????????????
>> ??????????? ????????????? ? ???? ?????????? ??????.
>>
>>
>> The English translations, as usual, seem way off: "ingrowing" sounds
>> more
>> like something unpleasant that happens with toenails, and "rooting" is
>> too
>> placid and botanical--and besides, "rooting" is NOT the THIRD stage of
>> plant
>> growth.
>>
>> Besides, they are real English words, and "??????????" is a portmanteau
>> word, like "brillig" and "slithy" and "mimsy" in Carroll's poem of
>> made-up
>> words, "Jabberwocky".
>>
>> Last Sunday, Mr. Bae (who is a lurker and occasional contributor here)
>> pointed out that "smysl" and "znachenie" are really related to the
>> "money"
>> metaphor for word meanings: "smysl" is something like "use value" and
>> and
>> "znachenie" is something like "exchange value".
>>
>> Yes, it is PARTLY a matter of "microgenetic" value versus "sociogenetic"
>> value, except that of course microgenetic meaning is really much older.
>> All
>> meaning making is, in the final analysis, concrete, and that means that
>> it
>> is in the final analysis LOCAL.
>>
>>
>> I think there's a similar problem here. "??????????" has the idea of
>> "revolution", of "seizure of power" ("prise de conscience") but it also
>> has
>> the idea of turning a relation between people into a relation between
>> mental
>> functions, of transforming an external, imperialist war into an
>> internal, civil, one; as the Weathermen used to say during the Vietnam
>> era,
>> "bringing the war home".
>>
>> The problem is that "??????????" is not an accepted Russian word. It's
>> some
>> kind of portmanteau word, right? It's a microgenetic "sense" rather than
>> some kind of sociocultural "meaning". How to get the USE value that
>> Vygotsky
>> intends?
>>
>> Perhaps "??????????" is "interiorevolution"?
>>
>> David Kellogg
>> Seoul National University of Education
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
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>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Sincerely yours Bella Kotik-Friedgut
> _______________________________________________
> xmca mailing list
> xmca@weber.ucsd.edu
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>
--
Katarina A. Rodina
Research Fellow (PhD)/Logoped,MNLL
Department of Special Needs Education,
University of Oslo, P.O.Box 1140 Blindern,
NO-0318 Oslo, Norway
Phone: +47 41 108 408/Fax: +47 22 85 80 21
E-mail: katarina.rodina@isp.uio.no
http://staffdirectory.uv.uio.no/singleview/v1/index.php?user=katja
http://katarinarodina.blogspot.com/
Head of Russo-Norwegian Academic Relations,
The Vygotsky Institute of Psychology/RSUH
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